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200

One PC with many "bodies"

200 points posted to New Product Ideas, Simplify IT by gbfabiani Apr 8

I would be very pleased to have one disk ( or SSD) to move from my laptop to my home pc or from my laptop to a mini-laptop when I travel .

This way user will have always the same computer with him ( operating system, programs, data, configurations) , one only PC to care configuration and updating about , but many "pc bodies" depending on where he likes to use the pc .

It is not a shortcut to avoid to pay more than one OS licence , it will be fine to pay one licence each "body" pc used even it will not be possible a contemporary use of all pc's bodies, but I feel it will be terrific not to have anymore 3 different environments and to miss always sometyng every time on each separate machine.

jj22
Apr 9		 A good idea
phubert
Apr 9		 Use Linux and you won't need to worry about the "license"!!!
aikiwolfie
Apr 9		 There are a few products on the market that will do most of this for Windows XP. They let you take your documents and applications with you. Moving the OS around can be problematic though. Especially if it's Windows. Just getting roaming profiles working properly in Windows can be a nightmare.

Linux is happier to be moved around. The growing number of Live CD/DVD distributions is proof of that.
jmxz
Apr 9		 I already do this sometimes - with a bootable OS on a DVD-ROM and a Flash Drive with my home directory.

Now that I think of this - Doesn't this already work today?
Put the OS on an external USB drive, and boot off of that with whatever PC you're near?
aikiwolfie
Apr 9		 It does. Linux can boot from hard disk, floppy disk, flash pen drive, external USB devices, CDs and DVDs.
jdelidc
Apr 11		 i already do this. my flash drive has fedora linux installed and goes between 3 computers on a regular basis

you'd have to do a lot of yelling and screaming at microsoft to get them to even hear you on this. never gonna happen with windows os but will happen with others
jmxz
Apr 11		 @jdelidc:
Seems Microsoft would be happy with it so long as you paid for a license for every CPU you boot on, no? That might still be reasonable for many companies.
jdelidc
Apr 11		 true. would work legally with a site license. only thing is that "you can't install this on a removable drive" crud that it says during the install (which norton ghost ignores).... so i guess in a way this is already offered if you know how to play the system and if you got lots of money
aikiwolfie
Apr 12		 Having one OS instance that needs a license for every PC it's used on isn't exactly cost effective though is it? How much does Windows cost a business these days? How much does the additional site license cost?
jmxz
Apr 13		 @aikiwolfie: "Having one OS instance that needs a license for every PC it's used on isn't exactly cost effective though is it?"

Having software that needs a license (whether General Public License or some more onerous one) giving rights to use it on every PC it's used on is the norm, isn't it?

Having one that makes you pay $100+ per machine for such a use-license is silly, of course; but hey - this tax on the rest of the world sure helps the US economy keep going.
aikiwolfie
Apr 13		 It's the norm to when you have a license to use software on a PC to have the software installed on that PC. So you could say have ten PCs with ten instances of Windows running all at once with ten users. That's the norm.

In this case we're talking about having a single instance of the software installed to a portable device. Meaning only one person can use it at any given time.
jmxz
Apr 13		 Ah - So yeah - this doesn't work with vendors with insane license terms. I was just pointing out that almost all software (linux included) needs a license that gives you permission to run it on every PC on which it's used. Just that some licenses (like the one Linux uses) is more business friendly than others in this case.
sin
Apr 28		 It wouldn't be trivial from a technical POV either.
jmxz
Apr 28		 @sin: "It wouldn't be trivial from a technical POV either."

Good point - but can't tell if that's an argument for or against this idea.

Perhaps that should be posted as an Idea in it's own right: "we want products from Dell that are technologically innovative, not technological trivial"
aikiwolfie
Apr 28		 From a technical point of view it's all possible and already done in the Linux world. I'm just not sure how this could be achieved in the proprietary camp without breaching a license agreement.
jmxz
Apr 29		 @aikiwolfie: "I'm just not sure how this could be achieved in the proprietary camp without breaching a license agreement."

Re-negotiate the license. Dell's big enough to do that. That's why customers ask them rather than try it themselves directly.
aikiwolfie
Apr 29		 Then it comes down to the incentive to Dell. It's like asking for a no OS option or a consumer Linux option. The incentives have to be there for Dell before they'll even think about reading the idea. How does Dell make a profit from this? Services? Support? Higher cost of hardware?
jmxz
Apr 29		 @aikiwolfie: "how does Dell make a profit from this"

If it's indeed a desirable feature to the customer, and if Dell offers it but HP doesn't, I imagine this would translate into more customers moving to Dell from HP.

As a hardware vendor, I imagine Dell would make their profit from the margins on the hardware components they sell. No?

Or is Dell actually an advertising platform where You and I are the "product" that they're selling to their true customers - the software vendors who advertise through the Dell ad-and-trialware-distribution-channel (in the same way that broadcast TV sells their audience to advertisers on their networks)?
aikiwolfie
Apr 30		 The margins on hardware are supposedly very narrow. So I'd be inclined to say we are the "product".
tundrascout
May 2		 I think what he ment is a universal hardware platform, where you can move the hard drive from machine to machine - "operating system, programs, data, configurations" Sounds like a great idea, but unfortunately, I dont think it's practical. New needs for speed are changing daily due to technological progress that improve application quality and services. Ask yourself, why arent we still using 16 bit DOS?
aikiwolfie
May 3		 Linux runs just fine from USB and from bootable CD/DVD as has already been mentioned. As for 16-bit DOS. In part that's down to industry demands and in part it's down to Microsoft's business model.

This idea is workable. It's a good idea. It's already available in the Linux world. Microsoft license agreements are what stops it working in the Microsoft world. The technology isn't the barrier here.
jdelidc
May 3		 "unfortunately, I dont think it's practical"
i'd be screwed right now if it wasn't possible. not easy to be swaping hard drives all the time, not to mention worrying about dropping it in transport
aikiwolfie
May 14		 Red Hat's Fedora 9 Loads Portable Desktop On USBs. As I understand it, Dell offers Red Hat Enterprise Linux. If they put their support behind this new software there's no reason why Dell couldn't implement this idea.
jmxz
May 14		 @aikiwolfie:

IMHO That should be posted as a standalone Idea.

"Provide a Bootable Linux USB option on all computers".

This might be the magic trick by which Dell can still please Microsoft by only having Windows installed on the hard drive - while at the same time satisfy Dell Customers asking for Dual Boot and Linux systems.
aikiwolfie
May 14		 I find that idea ridiculous. Microsoft aren't the be all and end all of the world. I have no desire or will to please Microsoft in anyway. If I want a PC with Linux pre-installed then I expect Dell to deliver. If they don't I'll buy from elsewhere. The reasons for anybody to want to own Windows continue to evaporate with some positive movement on the games front, Valves source distribution engine or whatever is coming to Linux. Logically Steam downloadable games will follow if Valve likes what it sees.

Besides. Now that Red Hat has made it easy to load Linux onto a USB drive there's no reason why Dell can't deliver on this idea. It has nothing to do with Microsoft.
jdelidc
May 15		 i've been booting from usb since fedora 7. it's nothing new. that's just how slow dell is
aikiwolfie
May 15		 Yep. Pen drive Linux has been around for a while too. Red Hat just made it all easier to set up in Fedora 9.
jmxz
May 15		 Wonder if the right "Idea" should be "ship all OS's on removable drives; and use the hard disk space for user-data".

Then you could upgrade to the OS of your choice (a different linux distro, Windows 7.1, Solaris, whatever) extremely easily so long as you could find the right filesystem/drivers for your OS.
eagle0468
May 19		 Actually, the idea is conceivable using Windows OSes by having seperate hardware profiles which to boot from. The solution would be multiple installations of the OS on one drive. Just know which Install to boot to on the selected device. You could easily set your shared documents on a seperate partition or physical drive that would be available from any of the OS installations, even Linux for that matter. I don't know why Dell, or any other vendor for that matter, should be the catalyst for this though.
jdelidc
May 20		 either that or you could have a stripped down linux running a virtual copy of windows
aikiwolfie
May 20		 eagle0468, with multiple installations won't that require multiple licenses? If we could work beyond Microsoft's license restrictions you wouldn't need multiple installations. One would do. The problem is Microsoft likes to tie down your OS to a single machine because it sells licenses per CPU.

As I understand it 1 license covers 1 installation of Windows for 1 CPU. As has already been stated. The technology isn't the barrier. It's Microsoft.
jmxz
May 20		 @aikiwolfie:
Microsoft's surprisingly flexible when it comes to licensing - you just need a big enough organization to make it worth their time to negotiate with them.

They were flexible in making more sane licenses for standby database servers when large disaster-recovery organizations complained that it was unfair to pay full license fees for a machine just collecting database transaction logs to act as a standby/failover server.

They were flexible in offering XP long after they said they'd kill it when computer vendors like HP said their customers still wanted it.

They were flexible in offering the source code - both to embedded systems vendors, even giving them a license to tweak it, and to customers concerned about back doors.

All the comments saying saying that Microsoft Licensing prevents an Idea is forgetting that Dell's not just some random end user - they're a big company that presumably has negotiators who can speak to Microsoft instead of just bending over a table when it comes time to sign a new contract with them.
aikiwolfie
May 20		 Well I don't know anything about the server thing. But the XP thing was in response to the progress Linux has made in the market recently and the fact that Vista is a flop. Most of the licenses they've sold are either pre-installed or corporate licenses. For which we know many organizations or individuals have taken advantage of the downgrade loophole. Even Dell has done it.

The trouble is most companies just aren't big enough to tell Microsoft what to do. Dell only gets away with it because it would hurt Microsoft financially if Dell dropped their products. But even it seems to be like pulling teeth to get Microsoft to behave in a manner that is fair.

The bottom line is Microsoft only cooperate when a market is at risk or they will be hurt financially.
phubert
May 21		 ?You mean like here:

Open source trumps Microsoft in UK schools

MICROSOFT has suffered further set-backs in the UK education sector this week after Becta, the government procurement quango, reformed its purchasing regime to break the software giant's hold on education, and launched a programme to get schools to adopt open source software. ****

http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/05/21/open-source-trumps-mic...
aikiwolfie
May 21		 Awesome! About time they did something useful.
phubert
May 21		 true... now if they only sustain it!
aikiwolfie
May 21		 Sustaining open source isn't a problem when OSS developers produce something that is useful to people. So the challenge is actually to meet the demands of the consumer by developing useful software.
phubert
May 22		 I wasn't referring to the support side, aikiwolfie, I was referring to BECTA's RESOLVE.
aikiwolfie
May 22		 Now that Becta has taken this course it will be pretty hard for them to back peddle. Especially given that the bidding has already started. The only way out of it is to some how claim Microsoft was offering a better deal. But that deal will no doubt be subject to scrutiny by interested parties.

If at the end of the day, the only thing open source developers get is their names on the approved suppliers list then it's still a small victory and a step forward in the right direction.

Microsoft in this case will have to play by the rules. They can't make an offer at a lose to themselves purely to keep the contract. So far as I know that isn't allowed in the public sector and I think Gordon Brown would really like to avoid any more scandals right now. It's a good time to be a Microsoft competitor doing business with the government or government agencies.
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